NW Newbie Seeking Some 101 Help >.<

MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Hey gang, new to the boards and thought I'd slide down to the introductions page before I got started anywhere else.

I'll start by saying I have zero smoking experience. I would consider myself an intermediately skilled grill-man but I've never done any smoking, until misses clause left me a present this christmas.

The wife knew it was something I've been wanting to try, so she ended up picking me up a Master Forge upright double door smoker for me. Candidly, I was a little conflicted about a propane-fueled smoker, but after reading around the net, it seems like quite a few people have been able to replicate the qualities of a wood smoker, so I'm looking forward to getting started with it. =)

My smoker got broken in today with a 4.5lb chunk of pig. I'm not overly huge on pork, but I read recently that pork butt/picnic is one of the most 'forgiving' pieces of meat for a newbie so I decided to start there.

Long story short, I ended up getting called into work after about an hour of the smoker going, and so I did a quick 1-2 with the wife on what little I knew and let her take over for the remainder.

After what should of been almost 7.5 hrs, I came home and wanted to see how it was looking. Well... the water tray was dry, but she said she had been adding water to it, so it must of just recently ran out. (I'll take that with a grain of salt though lol). It was late and time for dinner, pulled the pork out.... and it was like uncooked chicken. It was still rubbery.

The smoker temp was sitting at right around 210 degrees when I pulled it... but the pork was comfortable to touch within 4-5 minutes of coming out. I stuck, it and temp'ed it and it was only at about 90 degrees. I couldn't believe that it was only 90 degrees warm after the smoker had been going for hours.

We ditched the pork and whipped up some shrimp scampi for dinner, but I'm a little bummed on the pork not turning out.

I know it should of been hotter in the smoker, say 240-260ish. But she also told me that the smoker was going through a handful of soaked chips every 15 minutes or so... Everything I read online was like 45 minutes to 1.5 hrs on a gas grill. Obviously I/we are missing something... ideas?

I've also read some people saying they "pull XYZ at 140 degrees" or whatever... Is there a target temp that I stop the smoking for a piece of meat? And does it really take -hours- for that temp to be reached? I don't know what I don't know, and a lot of the info I've found online is geared towards a wood smoker.

I would love any advice/direction on how to properly operate the propane smoker, and how to smoke based off times/temps, and pretty much any other 101 advice I may need to start getting at least edible pieces of meat to start learning with. lol

Sorry for the long hello to the boards, but I look forward to getting to know the group and finding some wisdom =)

k.a.m. · Posted: Dec 29 2011 Post subject:

Welcome to the ring MeatJunkie, looking forward to seeing some pics of your cooks. Smile

Your first cook sounds like the pork was way under cooked.
Finished pork for pulling should be at an internal temp of at least 195° to 205° the probe should slide in and out easily and if it is a bone in cut the bone should slip out with a slight twist and tug.
I would ditch the chips and go to dry wood chunks for smoke in my opinion chips are a waist of money on long cooks unless you rig up a can and foil lid to slow the burn some.
On pork Butts or picnics you can easily run your cooker at 250° to 275°. If you want to foil the Butt during the cook let the internal temp reach at least 165° internal, personally I do not foil during the cook unless I am pressed for time I do foil at the end for resting and I let them rest for at least 45min.

I know your first cook went south and you have little documentation but try again and keep notes of the cook session, they will be good reference points for you in future cooks. Once you know the cooker it will work for you.
I hope this helps. Smile

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smokinit · Posted: Dec 30 2011 Post subject:

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MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Hey, thanks for the welcome and the tips!

Yeah it was way undercooked, so a higher temp will definitely be needed. I'll make sure to check the internal temp as well (was only going off the smoker's temp) and look for the 195-205 number.

I still have a small bag of chips from the first go-around, but I have some alder firewood that I could chop down into small chunks... how'd that work? >.<

I picked up a lovely 7.8lb pork roast last night, and will be giving it another go here in a couple days (whenever I get another day off. Bleh lol)

What would you recommend for time? 1.5 Hrs per lb? That'd be 11-12 hrs.

And any recommendation for flavoring? Tenderloins on the grill are usually my thing... so the first thing I'm tempted to do, is throw it in some brine overnight, then dry-rub it. But I have little experience with pork, and zero, minus the other day's flop, for smoking. Could use a simple recipe for success. =)

And lastly, I remember reading (and seeing on a cooking show) that it's common for people to use apple juice ina spray bottle during the cook, thoughts/advice on that too?

Thanks again for the info!

k.a.m. · Posted: Dec 31 2011 Post subject:

MeatJunkie, Alder will do fine for your smoke just make sure it is well seasoned and dry.
1.5hrs. per lb. is a good reference but never rely on time always go by temp. What I do is from my target meal time count backwards 1.5 per lb and add 3hrs. this allows me time if the pork or beef stalls. You can safely hold a Butt for an easy 4hrs double wrapped in foil and then a large towel placed in a cooler it will be piping hot and well rested.
I make my own rubs and sauces but here is a rub that will work for pork.
http://thesmokering.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=5274
There are lots of rubs you will just need to experiment and find your flavor profile.
Two parts Apple juice and one part Apple cider vinegar is what I use to spritz with. I do not start spritzing until about 2/3's into the cook this allows the rub to set and not wash off.
I hope this helps. Smile

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MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Awesome, thank you. So 195ish is target temp... how long do I want the meat to smoke at 195?

MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Awesome, thank you. So 195ish is target temp... how long do I want the meat to smoke at 195?

k.a.m. · Posted: Dec 31 2011 Post subject:

MeatJunkie, 195° to 205° is the target temp for pulled pork. When it reaches this temp and your probe slips in and out easily the pork is done and ready to rest. If you decide to wrap the Butt during the cook let it get to at least 165° internal then place it in foil give it a final spritz and wrap it tight then when the Butt reaches your finished temp of 195° to 205° take it off the cooker to rest for at least 45min. If you decide not to foil during the cook then your finished temp is the 195° to 205° and you will take it off the cooker, foil and start the resting period.
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MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Thanks for all the help, k.a.m. =)

I don't really have any other questions but one - What decides/dictates wrapping the butt? Is it just a personal preference? What's the pro/cons?

Other than that, I think it's ready to just start getting some meat on the racks and seeing what I like best =)

k.a.m. · Posted: Jan 01 2012 Post subject:

Meatjunkie,wrapping is more a preference than anything. It is a way to speed up the cook or shut down the smoke in the meat. The down side is reduced bark. I prefer not to wrap but when I am pressed for time I will wrap.
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stringbender128 · Posted: Jan 01 2012 Post subject:

Welcome to the Ring!
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MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Thanks for the warm welcome and info guys.

My second attempt is just starting to get underway. I have a mix of mesquite and apple chips (could only find some chips =/) that were soaked in apple juice and some widmer hefeweizen for half an hour. I'm writing this, as I wait to see some white smoke start to roll out so I can put the meat on the rack.

The meat this time around, is a 7.8 lb pork butt, that I pat-dried and covered in a light coat of honey dijon mustard, and dry-rubbed with a pre-made pork rub, that was doctored up with about 2 tbs of smoked peprika, 3 tbs of chiptole powder, 1/2 tbs of mustard powder, and 3 tbs of dark brown sugar.

The rub has a lot of heat punch, which I like, and the brown sugar and apple juice spritz should make it a tasty sweet n' spicy flavor. The meat hit the rack about 5 minutes ago, I'll throw some pics up of my second attempt, if I remember to do so. lol

GF · Posted: Jan 03 2012 Post subject:

Meat Junkie, welcome and good luck on round 2.
You don't really want billowing white smoke, thin blue smoke is what your looking for. White smoke is like licking an ashtray. Shocked

Maybee try not soaking the chips, they smolder, not burn.
If your gonna put up pics, try in the general BBQ area, you'll get alot more info there.
BTW the rub sounds good.
Good luck.

MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Smoker doesn't seem to want to get above the 200-210 range, according to the gauge on the door. =/ I remember reading some reviews on the smoker I got, and the only two complaints I seen (but a lot of them for each issue) is smoke comes out of the doors, and the thermometer in the door can be drastically off by +/- 75 degrees.

I think I'm gonna have to fly a little blind, and go by my gut, and just check the internal temp of the meat periodically.

The meat has been on for almost exactly an hour... I started the chips about 30 minutes before putting the meat on, and I've already had to throw in some new chips a bit ago.

If the meat turns out this go-around, I'll be stoked, but I think an off-set, horizontal smoker is in my semi-near future.

ocbbqman · Posted: Jan 03 2012 Post subject:

To help with the temperature get a digital thermometer and put it inside the cooker with a read out on the outside of the cooker. they have them that will have a wire lead to the read out, this will allow you to watch your cooking temperature more. Also when i got my first gas smoker i had to mark the temperature readings based on that to help the next time i cooked. I found that gas does go through more wood chips, chunks are the better way to go if the smoker box is big enough, and try putting some apple cider in the water pan, it will help with flavoring of the meat. and keep going with the pork butt. Not only is it forgiving, but it is also the cheapest piece of meat to learn with. And once you get the butt down, you will want to make it every weekend. When I start up my BBQ the entire neighbor hood comes out to ask for some.

MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

Yeah I've been getting white smoke, thought I was supposed to soak the chips! D'oh! >.<

I'm 4 hours into the smoke, so I'll start using dry pieces from now on.

Also, I ran to the store after throwing some new chips in, and picked up some mesquite *chunks*. I'll have to chop a couple in half with a hatchet to allow them to fit in the box, but half of them are going in, just fine. I'm hoping to see them last a good while longer.

I also picked up 2 thermometers. A new one to test the center of the meat with, and another to hang inside the smoker and give me a 2nd reading, so I can judge how close the door-mounted gauge is, that came with the smoker.

After putting the 2nd thermometer in the smoker and comparing it to the one in the door - the door reads about 210 degrees, one that is free-hanging inside - 270! O.O And they're only about 6" away from each other. I read reviews that the thermometer that came with the smoker was crap - but good lord. lol

Anyway, I'm on the temp now, and will be using *dry chunks* for the rest of the smoke. Hope I didn't already give it a strong ashy taste, ah well. =)

SoEzzy · Posted: Jan 03 2012 Post subject:

Just an FYI Mesquite has a singular flavor...

You might want to learn how much to use first with milder flavored woods before going full bore on Mesquite.

I have eaten good smoke meat from a Mesquite fire, and from Mesquite chunks on a charcoal fire, but I've also tajing one bite of several folks food that was over smoked with Mesquite as they did not know what they were doing with a strong oily flavored wood.

See disclaimer below!
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MeatJunkie · Joined: 29 Dec 2011 Posts: 22 Location: Western, WA

I do a lot of grilling, and one of the main hobbies the wife and I have together is cooking. I'm not jumping for joy over mesquite, as I know it can be pretty darn strong. I know the apple I have can be pretty mild so I'm hoping to strike a balance some place. But I can only assume (and that's a dangerous word) how this or that is going to turn out, without having smoked before. So... trial and error until I find what I like. =)

Btw - is there much of a risk of the mesquite chunks catching fire without soaking them? They're sitting in a fire tray so they aren't getting any direct flame hitting them or anything, but still a concern of mine.

SoEzzy · Posted: Jan 03 2012 Post subject:

IMO it would me better for you if they did catch fire as that burn off some of the things that can cause the problems with Mesquite and similar woods when they are just smoldering, soaking them is just going to cause more smoldering not less, that's one reason most smokers DON'T soak their chips or chunks.
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